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Follow the money.
  • Australia_CallingAustralia_Calling June 2011
    Posts: 42
    Reply to @someonefromhungary:

    From what i heard the voting process is according to legal requirements for constitutional changes in Australian non-profits - it all comes to us in legal jargon so will have been gone over by the Association's legal people.

    It is not possible to change these laws - they are standards set by the government, and yes that does mean that just 20 people could potentially block change. But if you stop and think of it another way it also means that if this change does come it is truly the opinion from the great majority of the members and this will be a very clear sign to all involved.

    It sounds a bit risky but it will be a really good thing for the organisation if everyone can make it happen. This will clearly demonstrate the organisation represents the members and not one leader in another country. If change doesn't come it will indicate something very scary about the future of the organisation.

    If this process is dropped we also have no change. So, from where i sit it seems there is no choice really but to try - at least then we know.

    What this all shows is the importance of having people on the new board who have the skills and capacity to take on these roles - people who the majority of members trust. The vote for the board members is a simple majority vote and this happens first.

    Now it is up to the members to find amongst themselves the people who they feel can best represent them at this level and nominate them. If the only people who are nominated are the ones on Gurudev's list then they will be the ones elected. I heard that its like that in all countries around the world - he says this person, that person etc and sits in front of everyone and asks them to nod at the right time.
    So, this is an opportunity for change.

    God of all things, protect us from the vampires, robots, 20 thieves, muppets and the like.

    Lets hope the members get to work on a good list for a new board - then something good may come of all this.
  • someonefromhungary June 2011
    Posts: 334
    Reply to @Australia_Calling: thank you, it's completely clear. and I agree. and I would like to add that it's already good that at least there are options and members are invited to vote for these options. and that it will be interesting to see the outcome of the voting -- whetever it will be.
    (and as much as I have heard from a number of persons, elections here are the way you described.)
  • pavitra June 2011
    Posts: 270
    Reply to @Australia_Calling: from my personal experience in every group you will have only a few people that know what they want (higher motivation or ineterests) while the large majority will just follow the momentary trend in the discussion. This is especially true if you have some instantanous public voting. People need time to digest some argument and take the proper decision. Be prepared to bring in front of the people your arguments whenever the "other side" will bring theirs. Take time. Ask questions. Discuss openly and honestly. Don't forget that you are still part of an absolutist totalitarian organisation and I have the fear that the Inner Circle will do whatever they can to influence the vote. Try to imagine what kind of lies they may use. Bring with you your own copy of the Association laws and ask, ask, ask and ask again. I'm sorry but I'm really worried.
  • mangotree June 2011
    Posts: 118
    Absolutist totalitarian regime?
    The voice of the crumbling inner circle....

    Small acts of autonomy in Australia:

    - the yellow uniforms are known as 'canary suits' and for some reason very few people choose to dress up as fluffy little yellow birds - despite numerous Guru vakyas. Some subversive disciples have been overheard making up irreverant songs about this and were seen laughing for days - shame, shame, shame.

    - joys of "the system" - when visiting India Australians are generally required to do hours of homework to figure out how to teach the system according to the yidl book - just in case they are asked to teach - otherwise the fanatics admonish Aussie teachers for speaking words not "in the system" - sacrilege!

    - more joys of "the system". Not so long ago one of the teachers here (who can teach 'systematically' really well) was asked by our Guru to design and teach a new program that would not be according to "the book" - you know - more like what so many people have been asking for over the last years - more challenging, more open, mixing levels, could include poses not in the system and a different order etc. When he taught his newly created classes to a group of people at a retreat he was shocked as nearly all the teachers came up to him afterwards and said - "So what was so different about that? That's how I always teach." - such impertanence :)

    Luckily we are already living in a far off island, otherwise we would be banished to a far off island....

    Tweet, tweet, tweet,
    pavana muktasana - eins, zwei, drei....
    marjari - eins, zwei, drei....
    trikonasana - eins, zwei, drei....
    tweet, tweet, tweet
  • pavitra June 2011
    Posts: 270
    reply to @mangotree: I'm so happy to hear that. CONGRATULATIONS! I'm coming from an ex-yougoslavian state and there we mostly just changed the photographs on the walls from one type of uniform to the other and the canary yellow is the biggest trend.
  • Australia_CallingAustralia_Calling June 2011
    Posts: 42
    What's happenning in Australia?

    @pavitra must be a psychic:
    "I have the fear that the Inner Circle will do whatever they can to influence the vote".

    Below is an email sent through to the yidl members in Australia - some proof of pavitra's concerns coming true. Apart from this email many people have of course received "personal" phone calls to "persuade" and "guide".

    The list of members seems to be in the hands of SriRa... who posted so many intimidating and bullying comments here not so long ago and he is the author of this email below. One thing to note is that i heard this man is not even a member of AAYIDL, so won't be at the meeting and has no right to vote, yet he keeps saying 'we, we, we'. His wife is a member evidently but her name is never added to the emails or posts - why would that be? I don't have the member list to check if this is true or not, but it sounds about right.

    So here you are - an emotionally charged email to AAYIDL members by SriRa... who is not a member, or so it seems...

    "No Guru, No Lineage, No Book and No System - are you ready for it?

    Dear Fellow Bhaktas

    At the upcoming meeting on the 26th, current members have been asked to approve a Special Resolution put up by the current Committee of AAYIDL that severs ALL linkage between the global yidl family and the Australian Association of yidl

    Indeed, the Committee’s Special Resolution proposes that even the name be changed to “Australian Association of Yoga” to remove even the slightest trace of its source of inspiration and creation!!

    If you are as confused and as distressed as I am, we should ask ourselves the following questions:

    1. Are we prepared to turn our backs and abandon Mahaprabhuji and his incredible teachings once and for all?

    Remember this is an irreversible step requiring us to shut out Mahaprabhuji’s Light from our lives and indeed, from our friends and families’ lives once and for all, as if the Divine Light never ever existed – are we ready for it?

    2. Are we prepared to shut Sw..Ji from our hearts and minds, forever once and for all?

    Are you so sure that each and every statement made by anonymous people on internet blogs is so TRUE beyond reasonable doubt, that you are prepared to ignore the love and kindness that Sw...Ji has demonstrated personally to each and every one of us?
    Sw...Ji has only ever shown love, compassion and forgiveness to each and everyone of us for all of our sins. He has tolerated our bad behaviour and always gives His blessings to all bhaktas.

    So many years of my spiritual work should I quit it and begin anew? So many years lost and will I gain it all again and will I be able to reach all that what I have now?

    Remember this is an irreversible step of hatefully spiting the Great Soul to whom we owe so much – are you ready for it?

    3. But above all else, are you prepared to be part of some anomalous and amorphous yoga-mob with a Brand NEW name and virtually nothing else?

    It is a fact that there is NO authentic yoga and spiritual system anywhere in the entire world which does NOT have a Guru and a proper Lineage (Iyengar has BKS Iyengar, Ashtanga and Vinyasa have Pattabhi Jois, Satyananda have Satyananda and Sivananda have Sivananda as their Gurus)

    Under the Committee’s NEW grouping, who will be the new Guru? What if the new Guru happens to be unauthentic and just looking to expand the empire?
    A true Guru would not accept bhaktas under these circumstances by taking over another Guru's life's work and ashrams.

    We have Mahaprabhuji’s wonderful lineage now, what will be the new Lineage?

    We have Lila Amrit as our Book now, what will be the new Book?

    We sing our wonderful Bhajans with devotion in our hearts (whether we understand them or not), what will be sung in the future? Just Kirtan?

    We can now proudly say “YIDL” is OUR system and we follow it, what will be the new System and where is it written?
    Will anyone know what they are truly getting?

    No Guru, No Lineage, No Book, No System – are we ready for this insensitive experiment with our Spiritual Lives?

    Thanks and kind regards
    Srira... (Real person using a Real name)
    Sydney-based Bhakta

    End of quote. Ra Ra Ra....

    There is much that could be said in response and one point is especially important.

    As i heard it and posted before the proposal for change is one that is intended to be "inclusive" not "exclusive" - it definitely ALLOWS for anyone to refer to the Guru, the lineage or the book and to teach according to the letter of 'the system' if they wish. The proposed change is for people to have a personal CHOICE about which yoga teachings to draw upon, which Guru to refer to and to choose which asanas to teach in their yoga class etc etc. Choice is what is being proposed.

    Imagine that - an association that allowed for personal choice - why is that so scary??
    Because then it would not be an absolutist totalitarian regime.

    Maybe @mangotree was wrong to defend the Aussie way, and soon everyone here will be tweeting away?

    God of all things, please offer us your protection from the vampires, robots, 20 thieves, absolute totalitarian regimists, yellow canaries, muppets and the like.

    Lets hope the members really do have a choice and something good may come of all this.
  • reality June 2011
    Posts: 17
    Reply to @Australia_Calling: Sounds like a political party speech in India before elections just luring people 'hey guys, please vote us to power, we will be the best corrupted people. If you did not enjoy enough corruption till now, here we are....' ha ha ha. Makes me laugh. Probably Mother India is crying seeing her children to get to this low state of mind.....

    Prayers to all souls. Let us pray that these people including Sw....gets some sense of human nature....
  • joyriver July 2011
    Posts: 101
    Reply to @Australia_Calling: Hello everybody, after some time, I'm back. I'm sorry but I just don't find time to follow this forum regularly. So, I missed a long part of conversation. But to this SriRa..... I would like to say something! Uuuuuuuufff, I'm so pi--ed off! It is silly, maybe, to react like this. But it just is not right. To manipulate people in such a way, and with no consequences? That makes me angry. But I can deal with my anger, I find it a great help in the area of protecting ones own psychic field. When I am angry, I know someone has just trespassed my personal boundaries. So, to SriRa... I hope you're reading this!

    1. Divine Light does not need to take any form. So Mahaprabhuji might be the simbol for that lihgt for some people and Jesus for others. You may even pick a stone to remind you of the divine light and it would be just as good. Nobody is turning their back on Divine Light if he/she shuts XXXX out! Or even if he shuts every bit of XXXX joga simbolism out.

    I am willing to tolerated my childrens bad behaviour and always give forgiveness to each and everyone of them for their »sins«!? They don't need a Swami for that! And neither do any of us, for the matter of fact. We can even forgive our own sins to ourselves. And give the love we need to ourselves. Try it. Sri Ra…. It might help you. You seem to need it very much.

    2. »So many years of my spiritual work should I quit it and begin anew?«
    No work is lost. You are still the same person. What you did is recorded within you. Why do you have so low self-esteem to need someone else to guide you or proove to you, taht your spiritual work is valuable. Why do you think you are no good enaugh to trust yourself that you can go on and nothing is lost? It seems that you need a lot of emotional support to feel safe.

    »Remember this is an irreversible step of hatefully spiting the Great Soul to whom we owe so much – are you ready for it?« Wisdom is not for sale, neither is love! So I do not owe anything to anyone. And neither do you. Honey, wake up!
    Stepping on your own feet does not mean hatefully spiting a great soul? What are you talking about?
    Independence and crytical thinking is not a sin!!! Step out of the shadow and dare to be yourself.

    3. There are many good yoga schools around the world. AAYIDL could just as well be good enaugh to go on without XXXX. Remebmer, it is the people that create a society, not the idea or one leader. But each and every one of us. And it is respectful relationships that keep it going. Don't forget to respect peoples rights to decide upon their own free will and personal judgement.
    And maybe, it is high time, people started to trust themselves and reach maturity, and not cling all life long on some authoritative image. The guru is within. People, we don't need to be guided by hand any more. C'm on, our own spirits are bright! Let this little light within shine.

    And besides, tradition is not always good. We have to be crytical in our judgement and release from this »lineage« the dust and dirt of abuse!
    I do belive Lila Amrit is a poorly written invention. But, if you like it.... It's your choice.
    And we can even be creative and write our own music and songs… So we can sing any devotional songs we like. Why only bhajans? Why not sing »This little light of mine«? (Yes, I like this song.) And there are many beautiful devotional songs in every nation's tradition. So…? Why not!

    »No Guru, No Lineage, No Book, No System – are we ready for this insensitive experiment with our Spiritual Lives?« Yes, yes, yes!!!! We are being very sensitive, indeed, if we take upon this path of freedom. Universe is love, so, you can not miss the target! The spyral of evolution goes on upwards. A child that learns to walk, does not need to be held by hands any more. And anyway, the child learns to walk by himself. There is no way you could teach him. This is human developement and human nature. Year by year we become wiser and wiser. The one who searches, will find. There needs not be an authority to decide upon our spiritual endevour. Because what we need to know, is within. Noone can take this from us, nor give it to us. We are born with it and we die with it. The only real spirituality is within.
    And maybe, if people have problems, like the ones you express in your letter, it would be wiser if they tried some therapy, first. There are many good new schools of psychotherapy, it does not need to be the old crazy and abusive Freud. (Try family therapy or imago therapy or something.)

    Sri Ra…. , your letter is a very manipulative attempt to coerce people, to awaken feelings of guilt (which is an abusive act) and to instill fear. Fxxx you, mister right!
    »Imagine that - an association that allowed for personal choice« – taht would be refreshing.

    Let's awaken peoples personal power, please, do. That's what yoga should be about!

  • RatanPuri June 2011
    Posts: 42
    ... threatening by "irreversible step" ? Poor threatened people.
    My God will take me back with Love whatever mistake I do.
    Now I see what is practice and what is theory. And of course I know perfectly what is worth more.
  • Roman June 2011
    Posts: 347
    Reply to @Australia_Calling:

    One thing is clear. If they achieve what they are trying to do with this letter, I say: “Everybody who is not yellow canary puppet and orange muppet, run!”

    We are preparing for hard landing in Kazakhstani (or maybe Rajasthani?) desert, comrades. Hold on to your books and safety lineages. We shall overcome.

    Systems are breaking down, systems are breaking down, system are brrrrrr……oooouuuuuuwn…

    And a flock of yellow canaries and orange muppets flew up and up and up towards a little old guy on the cloud. Then it started raining and the old guy has disappeared.

    Sh…t, where to fly now?
    I don’t know, call Australia.
    I don’t have any money. I’ve given it all to the cause.
    Then we are f…ked.

    This is the end, beautiful friend, this is the end, my only friend, the end... (Doors, The End)
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] June 2011
    Posts: 0
    Reply to @Roman:
    You all the time threatening (in such colorful way)people who are still with our master, but sorry, we are not afraid and we will not leave him because fear :-).
    Do you really hate so much all the people (huge number) who are staying with our lineage and with our master, or is it something else? We didn't do anything to you by trying to preserve our lineage from all that you are planning.
    Common, if majority in Australia are for; than they will win, if not, your side will win and then you will have tribe of all colors (read mixture of all yoga schools). If you hate yellow so much, you can exclude this color from your new “all colors” uniform and have “United colors of Aus- yelow is not allowed”...no need to this high emotion. Actually Beneton can pay you for commercial :-)
  • mangal June 2011
    Posts: 489
    Reply to @member: Nice to see you here again...Romans logic is simple, he believes that girls and maybe he is fed up with this primitive excuses-chidanda play, girls are ill, clever plan to destroy holy lineage..... Unfortunetly, after long dialog with one girl from my country and what is more-living very near to me, i must admit, that she has true.....
  • Australia_CallingAustralia_Calling June 2011
    Posts: 42
    Reply to @member:
    Actually @member it needs far, far more than a majority to bring about change.
    If it needed a simple majority then change would be quite straight forward and most likely would have happened already.

    It needs 75% of our members to say yes if a change is to happen.
    That means that just 20 people can say "no change" and 56 people can be saying "yes lets change" and still there will be no change.

    What an interesting organisation it will be then!!
    Can you imagine to be leading and guiding an organisation that looks like that?

    Whichever way the vote goes this is already the end of the organisation as we know it now. Change is inevitable, it just may not be the change that any of us had in mind.
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] June 2011
    Posts: 0
    Reply to @Australia_Calling:
    Well it is bad law. It is different, we have lower percent for making change, but this is like this in many countries and different association (NGO or other), big changes had to be will of the majority 51% or 75%. That is why by constitution of the new society people have to be very careful in making statute rules. But still, it is normal, 51% or 75% , majority have to be "for" change, this is normal for me. At least, if such situation this 56 people can step out and make new organization, anyhow the statuary name of this existing one is YIDL, that is nonsense that it stays like this and no trace of YIDL system in association, don't you think? It would be also interesting organization.
    For people who cannot stand our master any more is much healthier to step out of organization which recognize him as author, and you must admit, with yellow color or without; Sxxx and his system are roots on which this association is made on. I don’t think that this would exist without him coming down there.
    This letter is not so malicious to my point of view, think again. Of course it is to the point annoying to you, but it is just call to reconsider your feeling towards the founder and reason why this organization exist. I am sure that other side is doing the same.
    It is better , after marriage is finished to shake each other hand and say goodbye than to stay together by force. I am sure that you can make some agreement with those people who are staying about using halls and other things together (like sharing kids after divorce). Also about properties, this point that after closing one organization everything goes to roof organization, this is not just in YIDL, this is normal in cases where NGO is just branch and has roof organization (in this case Fellowship). I am not saying is it good or not, it is like this. And of course in every war you have extremists, but they are on both sides.
  • mangal June 2011
    Posts: 489
    Reply to @member: good point, yes extremists are on both sides. Therefore i think that both sides could be more humble, therefore, some triumphalism in yidl in this case could be soften...or what is it, when in yidl there is not any clue of thinkink about our or xxx mistakes? Our teachings is absolutly complete or it can be discused ?
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] June 2011
    Posts: 0
    Reply to @mangal:
    I think that it can be discused, our down under friends did it.
  • mangal June 2011
    Posts: 489
    Reply to @member: could you make it clear?
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] June 2011
    Posts: 0
    Reply to @mangal: Our Aus friends did discuse this before all this, they had some investigation as I understand.
  • Australia_CallingAustralia_Calling June 2011
    Posts: 42
    Reply to @member:
    The 75% law is from the government - not from the group.

    Glad to hear that you believe the "other side" deserve a divorce settlement if they step away.
    Lets see how much of the 5 million the 20 are willing to share with the 56 'unloyal others'.
  • PallasAthene June 2011
    Posts: 246
    Reply to @Australia_Calling:

    "The Australian Association of XXXXX (AAYXXL) is a non-governmental organisation in roster consultative status with the United Nations Economic and Social Council (ECOSOC) and affiliated with the Department of Public Information (DPI)."

    = 76 persons...????


    What are their consults as a NGO? Did they entered because of the humanitarian projects of Y...?

  • Roman June 2011
    Posts: 347
    Reply to@member:
    Is that how you understand the lying of the women on the website? And that I am possibly manufacturing the stories?
  • PallasAthene June 2011
    Posts: 246
    Reply to @Roman:

    Connex, member and some other guys or girls are mainly talking to you, Roman. They are not very interested in having discussion with others. Perhaps you are fit in special techniques and they want you to reload former stuff.

    They are not very fit in MS Office. That's a fact.
  • Roman June 2011
    Posts: 347
    Reply to @PallasAthene:
    It seems that they are reloading whatever they can. I don't call reloading communication. Sometimes I feel like a tired hardworking individual looking for a new direction, sometimes I feel like a fanatic and sometimes I feel like a nut. That's what I am getting using my special techniques.
  • mangal June 2011
    Posts: 489
    Maybe it is out of topic, but do you know something about austrian hospital? How it is functions and how much did it costs? I think, that if we want to follow the money we should find out where our money went. And a unnecessarily expensive hospital for poor people in desert with crazy expensive shape and without meaningfull usage is something like black hole.
  • truthseeker June 2011
    Posts: 541
    Reply to @mangal:


    In this link there is one sentence about the humanitarian projects:

    "Fundraising for the humanitarian projects in India running under International Sri Deep XXXXX Ashram Fellowship"

    So it looks like they want to put more money into this ''black hole'' as you call it.
  • mangal June 2011
    Posts: 489
    Reply to @truthseeker: Interesting, but does it function? Who is cured there? How many millions were spent for this crazy building and why it was spent rather for building than for ill people.... Hard to say...
  • seekingtruth June 2011
    Posts: 24
    Reply to @mangal: You can find many answers to your questions here: http://www.helphospital.org/ and here: http://jadanhospital.blogspot.com/ - it is a transparent charity in its early stages, doing its best to provide services in difficult conditions for: local people of the Pali District, workers on the OM Ashram building site, ashram karma yogis, and visitors from around the world.
  • mangal June 2011
    Posts: 489
    Reply to @seekingtruth: it sounds well- But....what is reality? When someone spent so much money for crazy-expensive building and the outcome is few seminars, expensive ayurveda course and time to time health care for villagers......when we use normal brain (not brainwashed).....so much money poured into black hole...megalomania and charity may have similar shapes, but it is different thing. I would not call it charity, just Megalomania-like new meditation hall in Strilky-fortunately it was cancelled-otherwise one more black hole without possibility of equivalent usage would be built...
  • mangal June 2011
    Posts: 489
    Reply to @seekingtruth: In short-do you think, that spending millions just for magalomanical building is equal to this goals? Or was there any other resolution. For example normal building, which can help earlier and more?....
  • Ivan June 2011
    Posts: 161
    Reply to @mangal: There are rumours that they can't get anyone to work there permanently, only some retired visiting doctor coming now and then. And building is huge... Because of some other problems also swAmi supposedly wanted to close the hospital and reuse it as a housing facility or yoga centre. (only a hearsay) But that was before whole scandal broke out. If the thing will be pushed further maybe they will put some more effort in the hospital project and make it work. Better to cure people there than produce more banana clad confuzees.
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